Tempted

iTrader: (2)

With all the stuff being talked about VRT lately I figured I would tell my story.

It started in the middle of March with this post "http://www.az350z.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2545"
Upon buying the turbo kit and finding out it was sitting at VRT just waiting for installation I went and did my research. At that time VRT was the spot to go(other then sharif or possibly AAM which were just way to far away). Little did I know what was coming.

Let me get this straight first. Michael Alvarez is a straight up outstanding individual when it comes to customer service. Michael went what I would consider above and beyond to make me comfortable with all the BS(well what I would consider BS) that came along with my install.

So. The week I bought the turbo kit I called VRT since it was sitting at there shop ready for install. Michael explained to me what extra would be needed to go with the turbo kit for it to be safe and just plain good to go. When we finally decided that VRT was where I would be going for the install Michael told me cost would be around 3500 dollars for everything. When I say everything I mean, turbo kit install, gauge install, split second box, tuning etc etc. Turbonetics out of the box run 360-380hp that is what I told him I wanted. I was explicit when I told him this was the power I was looking for.

We decided for the first week of May for my install time. Let it be known I am in the military. For me to lose my car for a week meant I had to take 1 weeks worth of leave(this is vacation time for you all in the civilian sector). We agreed the car would be done in a weeks time while I vacationed and visited my family in California. I dropped the car off at Michaels house(the VRT shop). While I was there we discussed extra safety such as a upgraded radiator and a oil cooler. He told me at that time it would be an extra 1500 dollars. Feeling confident in VRTs work I agreed to the price.

So I go on my vacation. Take my girlfriend(btw I love this women) to meet my whole family throughout California. I rent a car and we just go. 2 days before my car is supposed to be done I call Michael. Michael tells me that his main mechanic has been sick and he isn't sure if my car will be done. I take this like a hit to my stomach knowing that I can't take more time off of work to wait for the car to be completed. By Friday Michael lets me know my car won't be done in time for me to take it back to Arizona.

This is where Michaels customer service and dedication to his job comes into play. Michael tells me to rent a car and drive back to Phoenix, keep the car for a week and then he will pay for me to fly back to Cali the next Friday to pick the car up. I tell him to not worry about it and I will take care of it just to please make sure the car is done by the time I get there.

Well, I fly back to San Diego the next Friday and Michael picks me up from the airport. I am told my car is almost done. He tells me that somehow my car is boosting 10lbs of boost(this is supposedly off the wastegate spring that turbonetics supplied and with the relocation kit) (Miaplaya please inform me when the kit from turbonetics has ever come with a 10lb spring please). So michael gets me a 5lb spring for the wastegate(I boost 4lbs and have never seen the gauge go above that) and decides to just go with it knowing I wanted a safe tune and power. Throughout all this we go to lunch(michael bought me lunch thanks much) and go to see Jim Wolf, plus pickup another guys car from the dealership. We get to the VRT shop and my car is sitting there. According to Mark I am running extremely rich(below the 10.0 that the AEM UEGO AFR reads to) and we need to take it to JWT so Jim can figure out why. Jim tells Mark to do a custom tune instead of the JWT out of the box so Mark does this. Mark changes the tune back at the VRT shop and we head towards the dyno to see what is up with it.

We get to the dyno whereupon michael decides to dyno James car first(this is the fellow that JoeDirtPharmD referred to in . We put my car on the dyno whereupon it makes 2 dyno pulls only putting down 307hp@ the wheels with a 10.5 AFR through the band pretty much. Now I know I should have told them I wasn't happy with this, but honestly they seemed reluctant to retune since according to Michael it was safe. I left telling them I was happy with it although I really wasn't. I just wanted to take the car get home etc etc. BTW the radiator and oil cooler was not installed although they had still charged the credit card for 5500 dollars.

Where the hell do I go from here.

Ok so over the next month or so I try to work a date with Michael for me to come out and finish getting the radiator and oil cooler installed plus getting the new wastegate spring and a retune. He gives me 3 options. 1 Take the car somewhere here in AZ and he will ship the items to me and pay for them to get installed. 2 Drive back to Cali drop the car off and fly back out to pick it up. 3 Fly one of his mechanics out to drive the car back to Cali and get the work done whereupon I come to pick it up. Option #1 was tough as I wanted it done by VRT as they were the ones who were supposed to be doing my car. #2 I could not take the time off work during the week to drive it out there. The day after he gives me these 3 options he pretty much forgets number 3(which I gladly would have taken and would have paid for my own rental car here and flight out there). He tells me he can't schedule the work as his shop is not like walmart(yes this is the analogy he used) and they didn't work 24/7 or on the weekends(I understand you dont work 24/7 but I paid for work that hadnt been done).

Since we could not work the options he sends me a check for 1500 dollars tells me to get a electronic boost controller and just up the boost to 8lbs as it will be fine. So I guess all is said and done even though the car is not where we agreed it would be at.

Now to my conclusions. Here is a quote from a very respectable shop on here and what they would have charged
I will not say who I am quoting this from but honeslty how the F*** did I spend 4k at VRT when my car is not even technically done. Don't get me wrong Michaels customer service was top notch but like I said I told him where I wanted my car when it was done and it was not even close. BTW I never got a receipt for all of the work that was done.

Michael. I am not flaming VRT but this is just a customers review.

If I had gone the JWT route I am sure I would have been perfectly happy. VRT knows the kit and the tuning for it like no one else.

Michael if you want to talk about this and possibly set everything right please call me. Like I said above, your customer service is great i just feel when I talk to you on the phone that you make it out that the car is perfect and needs nothing else. I feel different. I just want the car where it is supposed to be and feel that for 4000 dollars it should be running correctly.

To all of you VRT fans with the JWT kit you are right. With that kit they are the place you want to go. Please no negative comments on this. I am honestly upset to the point where I just want to be rid of the car since this has caused me gried over the last 2 months(seriously I love my car but I am very upset).

So no negative comments. This is not a flamefest for used, philthy, nv350z or anyone out there. This is just how I feel and it is about time everything was brought to light.

I am sure there is much more to this story but at 1:25am in the morning I am sure I have missed items. Michael like I said give me a call if you want to talk about this. I would hope that your not pissed but honestly I understand if you are as my reaction would be pure rage.

JoeDirtPharmD

iTrader: (9)

Dammit Mike - I wished we had talked more upon your return - I would have driven her out to SD and let you borrow mine in the meantime. I have family there (in Del Mar and El Cajon/Santee) and free airfare anytime.

Should you and VRT work it out, lemme know if you need a driver

sentry65

iTrader: (11)

so you really don't trust any shops in phoenix to do a simple radiator, oil cooler, and wastegate spring install?

taurran

iTrader: (18)

I know this is probably only half the story, but...

...Let me get this straight.. they installed a split second box off a JWT kit and expected it to run with the out of the box tune on a turbonetics kit with 380cc injectors? That's just rediculous.

Do you actually run the car at the track or did they talk you into buying an oil cooler and radiator? You don't need any of that for normal street driving. It will never hurt, but you're really just throwing money at it needlessly unless you plan on hitting the road course for extended periods.

Also, Turbonetics includes a 9lb spring with the kit. It will boost 8-8.5psi on that wastegate spring due to pressure loss across the intake tract (intercooler). The install is bad. Tell them to check all the lines to make sure they're routed to the appropriate port on the wastegate/turbo/bov. There should be absolutely no reason why they should try to "smooth things over" by making you buy a boost controller. This is, if the boost controller would even be able to control the actuator proprly (doubtful). The wastegate spring IS the most accurate way to control boost. Solenoids fail, electronic settings change, but the spring is what basically regulates the actuator so there is no working around it.

There's no reason why you should take a half *** install and try to cover it up with tuning and electronics. I read about this stuff all the time and it pisses me off that tuners think they can get away with it.


I don't really care how many plane flights or rental cars they're willing to hook you up with. There should be no reason why stuff like this should happen in the first place. IMO, it sounds like they only have experience with one type of kit and have yet to get a feel for turbocharged setups in general. I'd say find a local experienced tuner that has experience with turbocharged imports (supras, 240sx's, hondas, 300zx's, 350z's), intense motorsports for instance, and let them get the job finished correctly.

Oh, and good luck getting this straightened out. I really feel for you.

IslandZavage

iTrader: (8)

At least you were happy with customer service. I had a similar instance with a certain shop in MIAMI when i had my 300ZXTT. It was so bad i would go to their shop cause they wouldnt answer there phones, call them from outside the shop and watch them look at the phone and just hang-up. The day i had someone take it to them i was being deployed so they never seen me face to face, just talked (few times) on the phone. Whats so bad is my Z was there for over 2 months getting an engine built-up, etc... I was told it would take no more than 3-4 weeks. After much frustration of getting back from deployment i really needed a car and renting was too costly for an extra month, but luckily i had a good roommate who let me share his truck with him. Oh yeah, by the way - I was stationed in Hunter Army Airfield GAwhile my car was in MIAMI FL. Theres not much research you can do on shops when your stuck in another country in the desert. When i got deployed (AGAIN) they assured me i would be up and running. Well i got back and flew to MIAMI cause they told mne my car was ready, only to find that it wasnt. Needing to be back in GA i had to just leave it and GREYHOUND back to base. I found out alot if ish about this shop and shady deals they do, charging for un-needed parts, swaping old parts for new and charging you for new, etc.., but like i said being in the military makes things alot HARDER, especially for a guy in a unit like mine. And like you I was in the military so i know how it is to be out of time or need to have a completion date.

Didnt mean to hijack your thread, but i understand. Theres more to my story, but talking about it hurts. All i know now is i will be very cuatious next time around with my 350Z. Im gonna make sure im at the shop more than a few times to ask alot of questions and alot of research. I know alot of shops hate when someone asks alot of questions, but i been bent over backwards, so there just gonna have to take it if they want my money. This happen to me in 2001. I feel your pain.

You shouldnt of told them you were happy when you picked up the car. You should of told the the truth right there. but i understand the hassle you went through and you wanted your car back. hopefully they'll help you out. Good luck with that... Why dont you install the radiator and oilcooler yourself? My base had a kick-*** auto shop that they let soldiers use and do their own work with all the tool and lifts you'll ever need at a cost next to nothing.

PS- And if your the shop who bent me over, im still gonna F**K your **** up if I see you guys. I know your shop closed down, but know your out there somewhere.
(sorry about that guys, just bought back memories)

Gman2004

iTrader: (8)

Hahaha! You must be talking about South Florida Performance.

Ghost 350z

iTrader: (15)

ROFL!! I was thinking the same thing

chimmike

iTrader: (7)

the car runs rich because you're only running 4psi. And that's also why you're only making 305hp.

You should've done the reflash and just called it a day. But then again, hindsight is 20/20 lol.

ReV2Red

iTrader: (9)

That's interesting. Skeletons are coming out of the closet for VRT. That's the second post this week where there has been a problem with VRT. What's going on? I'm not saying anything bad about them, as i am in no position to criticise anybody about what or how they do things. It's just strange that all i ever here are good things about VRT, and now suddenly, in a week i here two bad things.

leeboyNY

iTrader: (21)

I feel you about spending so much money and not getting your dream car.... but it sounds as though you shoot yourself on the foot.... I have no association with VRT. Anyway.. First you didn't even bother to do a price comparison b/w shops in AZ and VRT before you choose VRT. What do you have against with shops in AZ? I would have installed my turbo kit at where JoeDirt tunes his car at. Second, you didn't tell VRT that you weren't happy with 306WHP at the spot... Finally, seems like you didn't keep the communication open with the VRT during the install... you didn't know they changed the spring before you arrived to pick up the car?

In my case, a reputable shop out of town offered to install the kit very cheap, but I went to a shop near where I live so I can check on the install every day. Checking the installation progress with the shop everyday on my way home from work made a HUGE difference in installation quality... What's done is done.. Move on.. take it as a good lesson on car tuning.. Get to know your local shop.. Become friends with them.. They will take good care of your car as if it is their own..

ReV2Red

iTrader: (9)

Maybe that's how it works in the far far east, but i can tell you in Europe for instance, if you take it to shop that doesn't have a clue, no matter how often you check up on it, you can't see EVERYTHING that they do, and they won't always tell you what they have done. I for one, never take my car to the average joedirt garage, because they WILL *** it up.
I for one firmly beleive in taking your prized possesion to the creme of the crop, no matter how far it is. Hell, i live in south Spain, and i was prepared to ship my car to the UK to have an engine swap on my old car, that's how important it is to me. I'm the kind of guy that when i get to FI the Z and build the internals, i wouldn't have a problem shipping the engine to Sharif in the US, if it means it's going to be done right.
Its unfortunate that he had a bad experience with VRT, but he did the right thing in going to a reputable shop.

doug

iTrader: (5)

i believe its the same situation

MIAPLAYA

iTrader: (3)

Well a quick search on this board would have resulted in you and everyone else on this board noticing that on some exhaust systems there was an overboost issue and that Turbonetics has since released and will provide free of charge to anyone who contacts them a wastegate relocation kit. This kit can be had as I said free of charge by calling REggie. Furthermore the "10 PSI spring" is not even a real spring. In fact a 10 PSI spring does not exist for the Evolution wastegate. There is however a 9 PSI spring which will net you 8 PSI of boost at the manifold if the system is operating correctly.

doug

iTrader: (5)

Exactly... XX Tuning is 35 mins from my house... CIP Motorsports is 15 mins from my house.. MRC is 2 1/2 hours... i researched and researched.. and researched...

What i found was 50% of XX Tuning customers loved them... and 50% thought they were selling stolen parts, doing poor tuning jobs and to top it off.. their Top Tuner had left the shop and trained someon to do as good a job as him.. so that killed the first 50% for me.

CIP Motorsports had done 1 Greddy TT install and that was on a G35 Coupe, that and they told me i would have to bring it elsewhere to have it tuned, because they had never tuned a TT Z/G35c before..

I researched that MRC had been turning around Z's by the min.. NA, FI, they were doing it and doing it good. I never seen MRC's Facility, I never spoke to anyone from MRC.

I have spent a total of 10 hours, driving 3 different cars, not having my car for a total of 1 month with choosing MRC.. but you know what? i would rather know its being done right, than to know its some rookie or some shop who has never tuned or installed a kit on a Z expermenting with my car..

It really doesn't matter if a shop is next door, or 5 hours away, obviously my checking up can only do so much... if i knew how to intall the kit and tune the kit enough that i could check up everyday, i would have done the install and tuning myself.

TTRANK

iTrader: (25)

If you decide to do the rest of the work here call Tony at UMS Tuning in Tempe. He is awesome and will take care of you for a great price!

UMSTuning.com

ktown z

iTrader: (8)

I feel your pain and I am not bashing any shop. I haven't seen my car in almost 3 months. I put my car in the shop to have a 3 inch dual with down pipes, wastegate dumps, 650cc injectors, aam return system and the utec with a tune. The shop quoted me a great price and said it would be done in a few days. Well I live over a hour away and drove up to the shop 4 days later-"not finished because the wastegate dumps were hard to install. It will be done in two days-" We have to order new gaskets for your intake manifold and it will be a few days". A week goes by and I drive back and forth from my home to the shop but still not finished. After about 3 weeks they have my car on the dyno but it wouldn't make power after 4000 rpms. So a week later I find the cure on this wonderful forum. I e-mail them the fix. It takes over 2 weeks for them to install the grounding wire. They told me it was installed but when I went to pick up my old engine management it was in the box. So I drove back to the shop the next day and gave it to them. They appologized and told me that the tech quit. That was about 3 weeks ago. Now they are still having trouble with the tune so I had to buy the turbo xs datalogger so turbo xs can assist with the tune. That should be in on this monday. I am pissed! No telling how much longer till I get my car back and I hope it is this year. The funny thing is my girlfriend ordered a car from a dealership to her spec two days after I put my car in the shop. They built and shipped it from europe and she got it 2 weeks ago.

Tempted

iTrader: (2)

Here we go to answer questions

Sentry I trusted them for the minor install and actually now I would trust dynocomp to have done the whole thing. When I first decided to go to VRT I had not heard much in the way of shops out here that had worked on the VQ platform.

I planned on doing some autocross and possibly even drifting it at some of the local events. Phoenix easily reaches 110 in the summer so I wanted the added precaution of them both.

No the car runs rich because it is running pretty much off of a basemap. If it had been tuned ie: just enough fuel for the 4lbs it would have still made more power just by leaning it out.


MIA. They used the wastegate reloaction kit on my car. I have the RSR GTMAG2 exhaust. I guess the exhaust was enough to still overboost using the relocation kit?

That should answer them all. Or at least the pertinent and semi pertinent ones.

G352NV

iTrader: (13)

I really dont understand why you had to have this installed at VRT. If you would have bought the JWT kit then cool. Install of these kits are pretty basic. Any shop in your area could have installed it. Its the tune you want and VRT always has JWT tune their cars because they have the JWT kit installed. Why would you go with a SS box for EM? For that price you could have had a plug in play Utech. If VRT suggested these things then you got took. Seeing these prices makes me REALLY want to open a shop!

taurran

iTrader: (18)

That shouldn't be the case. It's been tested on full 3"back single/td exhausts and it works.

Tempted

iTrader: (2)

At the time VRT had a good track record and as is they still do. As for why I went with VRT. Michael when I first called them since the kit was uninstalled from a friends car there wanted to do the install so he could know it was done right.